Podcast: Morneau, no less
The former finance minister on Trudeau, his critics and Canada's future
On Monday at the University of Toronto’s Munk School on Global Affairs and Public Policy, a full room heard me interview former Finance Minister Bill Morneau. Now that conversation has become the latest episode of my podcast. Here’s the episode on Apple Podcasts:
We really cover the waterfront in this extended conversation. Morneau discussed the way his political career began, and the way it ended. Of course I asked him whether it’s really over. I asked whether the WE charity controversy that was then engulfing the Trudeau government came up during his final conversation with the prime minister. The answer may surprise you! And I asked him about the zesty critiques his book has received from several political observers, including David Herle’s crew at The Curse of Politics.
We spend part of the interview discussing a graphic prepared by two economists for an OECD study. Here’s the graphic, which we actually simplified from the original but which is still fairly daunting:
Hahahaha only I would try to describe this beast on a podcast. But you can see why Morneau brings it up in his book. The authors are trying to extrapolate economic growth over the next four decades. It’s not a prediction: everyone knows circumstances will change over such a long timespan. Still, the country showing the lowest economic growth over that period is Canada. So we talk about what that might mean.
So there’s a lot in this conversation. One more primer for interested readers: my original article on Morneau’s book.
If you’re looking for the podcast on other platforms, you can find links to several of them here.
Making the podcast is the work of a big team. This is very much top-of-mind for me this week, when we’re recording interviews four nights in a row at the UofT’s Munk School. The Founding Sponsor of The Paul Wells Show is Telus. Our Title Sponsor is Compass Rose. Our Ottawa partner is the National Arts Centre. In Toronto, I’m the inaugural Journalist Fellow-in-Residence at the University of Toronto’s Munk School of Global Affairs and Public Policy. Antica Productions handles production for the podcast. The Toronto Star and iPolitics distribute and promote The Paul Wells Show. Kevin Breit recorded and performed the music.
We have a really exciting slate of guests in the new year. Tell a friend you listen to The Paul Wells Show. I’m glad you do.
"Morneauvian" is now my adjective for interesting and really, really carefully worded interviews on Canadian political podcasts.
I've only been listening to the "Curse of Politics" podcast for about a year and a half now, but I was at once struck by 1) the performative dialed-up-to-11 profanity, but more importantly 2) how much the Liberal duo reminded me of Steve Schmidt and his pals on The Lincoln Project. That's a long story. But it's instructive.
And yet I was still pretty amazed at that podcast's tri-partisan vitriol aimed personally at Morneau a couple of weeks back - when the former finance minister's imminent book publication was announced. Surely, I thought, Mr Morneau had deeply hurt this quartet with his policies, or perhaps via a leaked email.
But that wasn't the case. In fact it's just like Paul Wells describes it during the interview: envious of their places within the governing elites of this country (i.e., Laurentian guns for hire), they simply lashed out at an interloper. Viciously. It was almost like watching Global News and CBC reporters - plus a couple of senior columnists - turn on the trucker convoy ("Yobs with delusions of grandeur"). What delicate, almost fragile sensibilites these people have.
And it also illustrates beautifully one of Mr. Wells' proccupations, the idea that this government spends a great deal of time crafting communications when it could be governing. Mr Morneau upset that applecart, or at least exposed its empty bushels. And perhaps that's why Herle et al., were so *ad hominum* in their attacks.
This is a darned good interview. Tell your friends.
Thanks, Paul Wells.
Very worth listening to for anyone concerned about Canada's future. Thanks!